>I never once saw an example cited of these so-called distractions from being mission-focused that wasn't just affirming the basic dignity of a group of people.
You are free to affirm whatever you want, and have all sort of discussions about society at large when your aren't being paid for your time by someone else to do a job that has nothing to do with affirming groups of people.
>I simply cannot imagine working at a place that doesn't recognize the humanity of their workers. Utterly baffling and heartless mindset.
Its baffling to me that so many people feel entitled to espouse their social and cultural beliefs in the workplace instead of doing the job they are being paid to do. The way a workplace recognizes the humanity of their workers is by offering good wages, good hours and a generous benefits package.
You are free to work at companies where you can impose your political views on those arounds you. However people who don't want to work with you are free to go work for companies that doesn't let people like you do that, like Coinbase.
but that's thing...what is "social activism" here? I don't think having a single tweet or post from your company's account saying "happy Pride month, we love our LGBTQ+ Coinbasers" is activism really....it's just like, a nice thing to do. No one is saying Coinbase or any company should pay their employees to go make phone calls for Bernie Sanders' campaign on the clock. It seems like people are inventing some kind of strawman of "paid activism" that no one is asking for.
I don't know, more people celebrate Christmas compared to Pride month, but saying "Merry Christmas" can be seen as controversial. It's hard to imagine that "happy Pride month" is completly neutral.
> If you say “Merry Christmas” to someone who celebrates Hanukkah, Kwanzaa, or nothing at all, you could make them feel marginalized: like their own beliefs aren’t valued or respected by society. And that’s not a good way to feel around the holidays.
I'm not sure if that fits "examples of people complaining about it" however, as it's more "people trying to protect the feeling of marginalized groups", which isn't the same.
> On the other hand, people don't greet me with "happy pride" during June, but they do greet me with "merry Christmas" during December, so perhaps there's a false equivalency there too.
That's fair. Pride month is not a thing where I live, so it's hard to know exactly how people experience it. I was under the impression that it was really important and lots of people talked about it, but maybe it depends on where you live, or maybe it was a warped vision of reality.
Though to go back to the original subject, if people don't greet you with "happy Pride" during June, then wishing it would be definitely not neutral.
How about we stick to "a company can do everything it wants as long as it is legal and people are free to go work at whichever company they want"? Why is that controversial? If you want to effect social change become a politician, do not try to turn your work place into a political party that has to react to every social fashion.
The problem with the argument that this is making a workplace a political party is what the fuck are you supposed to do if you’re transitioning at work? Now you’re fucking political, and all you want is for your boss to call you she/her and your health insurance to cover your hormones.
Lets say that coinbase said "We are fully political at work, we expect all of you to have conservative views!". Would that make you happier than their current apolitical stance?
> What do you do in an apolitical workplace and you’re going to engage in controversial medical intervention to align your body with your believed gender?
You just do it? In an apolitical workspace that isn't a political act, what you do in your free time is up to you. And if you change your legal name people should update how they call you. Nothing of that is political. If people make a fuzz they are dragging politics in the workspace and should be reprimanded.
> I think this is a straw man that doesn’t actually address my question.
It isn't a strawman, I am just explaining how politics at work wouldn't solve your problem. However an apolitical workspace actually would solve your problem since it bars conservative politics as well.
The way you picture politics as a wholly separate thing unrelated to the amount of consideration/kindness toward LGBT people or minorities is alien to me.
Twenty+ years ago, being visibly gay in a workplace was much less popular, to the point that many people made the choice between hiding that about themselves or facing a more hostile workplace. Things are very different today in many places. Did society just get overall kinder, or did it go through a political change?
In the past, asserting a visibly gay person warranted more consideration and kindness was definitely "political". Was there some point it wholly stopped being so?
That’s what I don’t understand, because my understanding is that being conservative or progressive when it comes to trans people is no middle ground. Choosing to go with a trans persons new name and pronouns when they are early or mid transition is a political choice. There are laws passed explicitly around their bathrooms for example.
> Choosing to go with a trans persons new name and pronouns when they are early or mid transition is a political choice
No, it is just a kind gesture. It is like people not telling an overweight person they are fat, it is the normal thing to do. And if you go around calling people fat then in any healthy workplace they will call you in for a talk and tell you to stop being so rude.
The problem here is that you make this about politics and not about just common decency. If it is about politics then it makes sense for conservatives to reject your wish, you wont change them from being conservatives. But if you make it about common decency instead then they almost surely comply since most people are nice. Maybe not the first time you ask but after a few times almost everyone will, because they will see themselves as assholes if they don't.
> Choosing to go with a trans persons new name and pronouns when they are early or mid transition is a political choice.
It's not, at least not for me. I think what people do with their bodies is not my business. I think that if people want to be called a certain way, I'm fine with it. All I'm asking is a bit of forgiveness in case I make a mistake, as I'm bad with names. But most of the time it will be not remembering someone's name, not using the one they would prefer me not to use. I don't consider any of this political. My grandmother doesn't like her name, so everyone calls her by her nickname. I was a bit surprised when I saw her full name when I was young, but that's about it. I don't see any difference with trans people. Sure, the stuff behind is very different, the "why" is not the same. But that's not really my business. I think accomodating people, up to a certain degree, shouldn't come with conditions about the "why".
I think people tend to forget that it's normal to accommodate to some degree people that you work with. I have two vegetarian colleagues, so if I bring some food to work, I make something that they can eat. I would try the same if someone was vegan or allergic to nuts. I don't know why they are vegetarian, and I don't need to know why to respect them and try to accommodate them. On the other hand, they've never lectured me about what I eat.
The sibling comment about being overweight is also very true. I am overweight. I've never had any comments about it in the workplace. At my last job, all of my colleagues were very physically active. Sure, sometimes I felt a bit left out, but that's on me. They never made me feel uncomfortable about my weight. I was allowed to exist as a person, and not a fat person. That personally means a lot to me.
I don't have any good answers for the bathrooms. Individual unisex bathrooms would solve that, but not all offices are equipped with that, and adding them may not be possible. You're right that here, it may be a bit harder to accommodate them, depending on who you are. On the other hand, I'm fine with unisex bathrooms, as I'm not comfortable with urinals.
I realize that it's not everyone's cup of tea, and that some people will prefer a workplace where everyone is strongly aligned with them on almost everything. That's fine too.
All of that may be just an expression of privilege/luck/something, as I realize that not all workplaces are like mine. But these places do exists. I'm trying to raise awareness about them, in hope that some people will go look for them, instead of being abused by employers and colleagues that don't deserve them.
I don't think we should optimise workplaces for the smallest possible edge cases.
If you joined a bigoted company as a queer person and transitioned then you have to change your job, the same way if you join NPR and suddenly realise after spending too much time online that you are in fact right wing.
Work is a place where people go to earn money to do stuff they want after. It's not a place to get validation.
That doesn’t answer my question of what happens if someone transitions in a workplace. How do you do that non-politically? Dismissing the edge cases of marginalized people is kind of like… of course they’re edge cases. Marginalized people are edge cases by definition.
> That doesn’t answer my question of what happens if someone transitions in a workplace. How do you do that non-politically?
It is simple, you transition, you tell people you want to go by the other name now. If people say it wrong you remind them but don't get angry. If they harass it for it there are laws against harassment, bringing up harassment isn't political. You can discuss the medical benefits with your manager or HR, but don't have to try to make a political campaign about it.
If people makes a fuzz over those things then they are political and you can report them to whoever is in charge that they are bringing politics to work and causing problems. If they truly are against politics at work they will take your side and tell those people to stop.
What do you do if your peer reports you as political because asking people to go by your new name is a political demand? I’m genuinely asking, because I’m under the impression that even asking people to respect your pronouns can be too political, or trying to use a bathroom you think matches your gender.
If you legally changed your name then it isn't an political act.
> I’m genuinely asking, because I’m under the impression that even asking people to respect your pronouns can be too political
That is just your assumption here. Why are you assuming that? It is almost as if you assume "apolitical" means "conservative". That isn't true, even if the left tries to tell you that all "apolitical" people are really closet conservatives that isn't really the case.
I’m assuming that because there are laws in several places in the country about whether or not trans people can use certain bathrooms, so I’m assuming it’s a political thing.
I think my assumptions are different than you. I’ve met people, co workers, who have told me that a trans person asking to be described as a new name is political, and forcing the co worker to call them by a new name is forcing politics in the workplace. This is my understanding of what an apolitical workplace means. Am I wrong? I’ve generally avoided workplaces that claim to be apolitical explicitly because the people I know who claim to be apolitical actually claim that they’d never respect a trans persons new name, because that’s bringing politics into the workplace.
Then your problem isn't with apolitical workplaces, but with conservative workplaces.
Also, a few people saying that trans stuff is political doesn't mean that those views are the general consensus or that apolitical workplaces works with that. I haven't seen that and almost everywhere I've been doesn't really do politics at work. Trans people are just people etc, nobody cares.
I don't know. How do you tell an apolitical workspace from a progressive workspace if the progressive workspace claims it's apolitical?
But until we see that coinbase harasses trans people who work there I'll assume they are apolitical as they say and not conservative. If you have evidence that they did harass trans people as you fear then you can bring them up and we can see that coinbase isn't really apolitical, but until then you are just creating a problem out of nothing.
Plenty of companies have policies against politics at work, but I've never heard of a real expample where that caused issues with trans people. Instead people just bring up thought examples. I don't doubt it might have ever happened, but I don't think it is nearly as common or problematic as people try to make it out to be.
I can assure you that most people would not bat an eye they were asked to use a different pronoun. The problem starts when they are 1) forced to do so b) suddenly have to "disclose" their own pronouns, and you end up on a zoom call with he/hims she/hers and one they/them.
The problem is not that some people want to stop being marginalised, the problem is that the aim is to marginalise a normal person.
If they are rude then you can bring it up with your manager about them being rude. Companies usually doesn't accept rude behaviour or bullying. If they are fine with rude behaviour and bullying then you will have problems regardless of the political stance of the company.
There is no law that makes people call other people by their given names too. Or law that makes people call priests "father". I don't understand how that can be so hard to fathom.
> There is no law that makes people call other people by their given names too.
Actually this would likely fall under some form of workplace harassment issue, and the company would have a duty to stop the harassment. ("Offensive conduct may include, but is not limited to, offensive jokes, slurs, epithets or name calling, physical assaults or threats, intimidation, ridicule or mockery, insults or put-downs", and it's kind of hard to imagine how calling someone a name that isn't theirs isn't a form of mockery or name calling.)
> or trying to use a bathroom you think matches your gender
If you get in trouble for being in the wrong bathroom at work, you need to go find a company that isn’t full of children. Nobody has time to care where you pee
>It's baffling to me that people believe I should turn off my brain when I'm at work.
You should choose a place of employment that lets you behave as you feel you need to behave, not expect that you as the employee are the one who decides on the standards of behavior.
Then don't work for someone who you don't consider sufficiently woke! Nobody is being forced to work at Coinbase. If you don't like the idea that you are hired to do a job instead of running a social justice campaign, then don't take that job, work somewhere else! The sense of entitlement is absolutely astounding.
You are free to affirm whatever you want, and have all sort of discussions about society at large when your aren't being paid for your time by someone else to do a job that has nothing to do with affirming groups of people.
>I simply cannot imagine working at a place that doesn't recognize the humanity of their workers. Utterly baffling and heartless mindset.
Its baffling to me that so many people feel entitled to espouse their social and cultural beliefs in the workplace instead of doing the job they are being paid to do. The way a workplace recognizes the humanity of their workers is by offering good wages, good hours and a generous benefits package.